SAIC to get 38,1% duty in EU

[DB Go Rex]

Now, what happens if China take the hump and tariff everything sold to China , or think sod it - lets raise our prices to everything we sell to the EU and USA?

They already do - that was the start of the issue - China already had an extra 15% extra duty on non-Chinese car imports. The EU were responding to that plus trying to stop the start of the inflood of Chinese government subsided sales in the EU.

Yes the EU car manufacturers are making money now, but that's going to start evaporating when you are dealing with a competitor that gets money from its own government every time it sells a car outside of China - this is part of the structure of these tariffs: if the Chinese manufacturer opens it's books to the EU and proofs it isn't getting bonuses from the government they get a much lower tariff. MG's is high because the Chinese government is a controlling shareholder of SAIC.

 

[GranTurismoEra]

I know, to protect our billions in profit we'll get the government's to introduce a tariff.
Who do those pesky Chinese think they are, selling cars that people want to buy in our turf.

https://uk.motor1.com/news/715061/ferrari-porsche-most-profitable-auto-makers/

The consumer is the lower.

They got all the muggins by the balls. "we can continue to raise our prices and people will still buy" - Porsche

"But Chinese buy Germans too....."

They do but they also buy domestic cars and their market is around 400 million+ people.

Slap a tariff on the German cars combined with locals opting for BYD, SAIC etc instead. Not very wise with no foresight. The German automakers should come to an agreement to get the tariffs removed and start pricing vehicles cheaper than. 70-90k....before its too late. UK now have a good reason for Brexit! No reason for any Mercedes EV to cost over 60k to 70k. Poor sales.

MG customers dont need to worry because the depreciation will never be as stiff as a Taycan lol..

 

[Roldorf]

During the Covid pandemic many parts for European car manufactures especially electronic components were either in short supply or totally out of stock. Car prices rocketed, second hand cars were priced more than new vehicles. Where did these parts come from? China.
All they have to do is put up the prices of these components, they can then subsidise the Chinese car manufacturers to negate the tariffs.

 

[AreFriendsElectric]

Something to keep an eye on in the UK. Potentially concerning for MG EV owners.

 

[DB Go Rex]

Something to keep an eye on in the UK. Potentially concerning for MG EV owners.

Buyers...

 

[unmaskedAvenger]

The big problem will be if the UK decides to apply the say tax and it then goes on to influence the price of insurance.

 

[Ruislip Resident]

If it means MG pulls out of EV sales in Europe (EU) because it prices them out, then it may impact the availability of spare parts. The Chinese could though just impose tariffs on any products from the EU and simply pass the money raised on as subsidies to MG to offset any tarrif, so the price does not increase. The EU already treat them as though they do this now.

 

[AreFriendsElectric]

As an MG EV owner in the UK, I would principally be concerned about the value of my car going forward.

 

[salty]

As an MG EV owner in the UK, I would principally be concerned about the value of my car going forward.

Why? Can't do owt about it. Just enjoy your motor. ??

 

[DB Go Rex]

From what I'm reading the profit margins are substantial on most Chinese EVs and the kick backs from the Chinese government will take up the slack on what they are losing, so I wouldn't expect much of a difference in pricing.

Don't forget - the ZS ICE version is a £13K car in China ?

 

[OriginalBigAl]

Its such a convoluted tit for tat , loophole filled , state of financial posturing that the headline figure is extremely unlikely. Remember there a lot of elections going on in Europe both now and the near future . Tough talk grabs headlines, but will be discarded as tomorrows frite paper, possibly leaving both legistrators and readers with greasy palms.

 

[AlexC]

China will do the same in kind to European vehicles in a market almost as large as the entirety of Europe. Despite their superior public transportation car sales are still key.

Good luck VW, BMW and Mercedes. They've already been advised against such decisions by German automakers. Also more and more Chinese are buying locally made cars.

UK's answer to that is the 40k roadtax penalty to get manufacturers on similar pricing levels, which is more difficult. Setting up factories in EU is a good idea but it doesn't stop special treatment of Chinese manufacturers if you know what I mean.

Its done to protect the EU market and jobs. Lets face facts no ones buying Mercedes EV, Mercedes are having a rethink as well as Ford. BMW EVs are taking a steep hit as well as Taycans. Time for EU manufacturers to get real and bring the prices down.

It's bad for everyone and a dumb move, protectionism never works. China will increase export tariffs on batteries!

 

[GranTurismoEra]

Europeans are always seeking alternative battery makers to not rely on China. Although its costing them more.

 

[DB Go Rex]

Interesting take in this article:

How German auto arrogance brought about Europe’s Kodak moment

Ursula von der Leyen's probe into illegal Chinese subsidies for EVs is an attempt to clean up the mess the German auto industry created

www.transportenvironment.org

this is more about protecting industry in Europe in general - hence why European manufacturers that produce some models in China and ship them to the EU are being hit with the tariffs as well.

 

[yellowking]

I can't speak for China but Thailand for instance imposes a 200% tariff on European cars and they still sell like crazy. Purely because they are seen as a status symbol. So you'd pay the the equivalent to £100k for a model 3 BMW.

However there is little to no duty on Chinese cars so an MG3 would cost around £7k to £8k.

The MG5 big saloon is £10k up depending on spec.

The MG 4 is about £16k

So there is plenty of profit on these cars.

 

[EVsince2016]

Heavy action to save the German car industry.

It would have made sense to match what the Chinese were doing with their 15% duty, but this will likely start escalation.

It will be interesting to see if it's enough for Chinese brands to start factories in Europe. Would need some more brand recognition for that to be viable, and it's a bit too early for the likes of Xpeng, BYD and NIO.

Apparently Tesla will also have a calculated tariff with the European Model 3 being made in China...

The German car industry objected to the tariff as they lose more than they gain!

 

[DB Go Rex]

The German car industry objected to the tariff as they lose more than they gain!

True but that's because they don't want a trade war and want their own Chinese manufactured cars to be tariff free.

If the EU roll over like a puppy on this, it's likely car manufacturing will eventually be close to dead in Europe and most cars will be built in China, much like what happened with the consumer electronics and other industries...

 

[Anon70]

If you bought a "German" car in China since 1984 this is where it was made, to get around import duty...

SAIC Volkswagen - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[tsedge]

History says that tariffs cannot be an end in themselves because all they do is protect home industries from having to adapt to foreign competition and eventually that becomes unsustainable. Plus they harm your own people by making goods more expensive.

Where they may make some sense is in giving breathing space for home industries to adapt when they are behind the competition and a brief period would make the difference. But this is extremely difficult for governments to judge and I highly doubt they have the competence to do this well.

The Chinese have done some amazing things with EVs. The proper response is to consider what industries we could do our own amazing job with and invest in them. We need to think positively about the future, not just be fearful of the present.

 

[scoobeesnac]

Chinese electric car makers hit with new European Union tariffs

The move poses a challenge to Beijing, which hopes EVs will help revive the country's flagging economy.

www.bbc.co.uk

SAIC has been hit with the highest new tariff of 37.6%.

Edit moderator: I merged this post into this existing thread.