MG ZS EV - what is wrong

[cog16]

Having spent all my working life in the software industry, including support, problem management and customer satisfaction, I am absolutely shocked by the way MG are apparently NOT managing software, firmware and hardware evolution.
Looking casually through the forums, it is clear that , in the absence of an OTA( over the air) solution, they are in the process of (or possibly have already) losing control of the situation.
I cite the parallel with smartphones, where users are aware of which version they have ( if it means anything to them) and know whether there are updates that they are allowed to use, without having to be 'nerdy' or a code-cracker.
I used to have a Dieselgate Passat, and I wonder if MG might be in breach of Trade description laws, in quoting a WLTP which must clearly have some dependencies on versions of hardware, software and firmware, as well as speed, temperature etcetera, where the typical customer has NO idea of what WLTP to expect because they do not know enough about the items I just mentioned.
I would welcome a comment on all this from an official MG representative.

 

[Gomev]

It's probably more down to the dealers not applying updates when they are available.

 

[macd2401]

and I wonder if MG might be in breach of Trade description laws, in quoting a WLTP which must clearly have some dependencies on versions of hardware, software and firmware, as well as speed, temperature etcetera, where the typical customer has NO idea of what WLTP to expect because they do not know enough about the items I just mentioned.

Could that not be applied to pretty much every car manufacturer ever? Since EV performance depends on a range of variables, every manufacturer can have the same charge levelled at them.

Any economy figures are best used as a comparison between different vehicles, because real world use can't possibly emulate or be emulated by a test cycle, even though it may well be standardised.

My old pick up was built before E5 was a thing...should I now sue because E10 exists, and my economy will be different? Same with bio or SVO. If the vehicle is being used outside of the test envelope, the results will be different. That doesn't make the manufacturer a fibber, it just proves the test isn't the real world.

Don't disagree with the first part of your post though. MG and the dealer network have largely dropped the ball on the software/updates front, barring a few notable exceptions, who rightly get regular praise on here.

 

[Popsie5859]

macd2401, I agree with everything you say the real world with any modern piece equipment is never anything like tests conducted under laboratory conditions. The same can also be said about buying two identical vehicles with the same mileage and same setup, both drivers pull away at the same time but there will almost instantly be two different set of figures returned every thing is different and used in slightly different ways. What might be good is if any updates were freely available to download and allow the customers to carry them out themselves.

 

[macd2401]

I'd like to see downloads being available, but I can see why they don't allow it. I look around my work mates, and I wouldn't trust the majority to update their phones without breaking something ???

 

[cog16]

Thanks to all for your comments, and I find it difficult to argue with them, especially macd2401 over his mates.
My Dieselgate reference is the thought that if a bit of software is updated and has a significant impact on consumption, then my question might be, was the original WLTP totally wrong?

 

[Gomev]

Thanks to all for your comments, and I find it difficult to argue with them, especially macd2401 over his mates.
My Dieselgate reference is the thought that if a bit of software is updated and has a significant impact on consumption, then my question might be, was the original WLTP totally wrong?

No the original WLTP was not wrong, the cars that still have the original BMS software are quite happy. Those that have the latest BMS software are happy. Both are in line with the advertised WLTP.
What happened was a faulty BMS update was made to some cars, which has now been rectified with a correct update available.
Consider your Passatt, if you took it in for a service and they botched the job, would that be dieselgate, or would you just demand that it be rectified ?

 

[cog16]

No the original WLTP was not wrong, the cars that still have the original BMS software are quite happy. Those that have the latest BMS software are happy. Both are in line with the advertised WLTP.
What happened was a faulty BMS update was made to some cars, which has now been rectified with a correct update available.
Consider your Passatt, if you took it in for a service and they botched the job, would that be dieselgate, or would you just demand that it be rectified ?

Gomev, remember that I am still a newby to this EV, but for example a 5% increase in WLTP due to an update is small in itself, but can give 10km extra in autonomy. As we all know, WLTP is an almost impossible target to achieve, but if it 'fools' a user's expectation , then IMO, it comes under Dieselgate type Trade Description issue

 

[Chrispydoc]

After a while you will soon discover how far you can go on a charge. IMO Speed and driving style are the two most important factors. If i'm being careful I can do about 160 miles..if i'm thrashing it...as I was today...a lot less. I'm happy with it......until I get my longer range one!

 

[Gomev]

Gomev, remember that I am still a newby to this EV, but for example a 5% increase in WLTP due to an update is small in itself, but can give 10km extra in autonomy. As we all know, WLTP is an almost impossible target to achieve, but if it 'fools' a user's expectation , then IMO, it comes under Dieselgate type Trade Description issue

We are all still learning about our EVs, all the time even the old hands on here, so welcome to the club.

The WLTP will not change, it is 163 for the current ZS EV, that is just a comparison figure.
In summer/warmer weather many are achieving and surpassing this figure in their ZS EV, in winter nowhere near achieving.

I read your original post as suggesting that if they made changes to the BMS that adversely affected the range of the car then this could be a an issue under the TDA, however they haven't, they just messed up somewhat with a software update and took action to rectify.

 

[ryanoneill1970]

@cog16 complete agree. Same as you, software developer and appalled at how bad the version management is. Tried to get a dealer to update the BMS due to a breakdown, they updated the radio. Only through my distrust of them and tinkering did I find out what they'd done.

 

[Cocijo]

There’s a massive learning curve for dealerships taking on EV’s. Most that are completely entrenched in the ice world are terrible.

 

[ABDALLA]

Software of this car is the reason that I intend to sell it, since the dealer don't know about latest updates to fix

 

[TassiedEVil]

Software of this car is the reason that I intend to sell it, since the dealer don't know about latest updates to fix

Maybe you could try contacting MG headquarters in UAE and explain your frustration and disappointment with the dealer’s lack of knowledge. They might surprise you!!

 

[Tim Falkiner]

All this software controlled driving is pretty hairy. One should be able to get in a strange car and pick up the controls quite quickly, as one could do before computers. But now there are some similarities but each car has its own menus and functions and it is not always easy to ascertain what they are, whether they have been selected and how they operate. And it can be a matter of life and death. The only thing I have found that operates on all cars is the steering wheel and brake. If you turn it to the left, the car goes left and if you turn it to the right the car goes right. And if you put your foot on the brake the car slows.

 

[Kithmo]

Life and death.....

 

[Tim Falkiner]

Life and death.....

I stand corrected. When I wrote, "if you put your foot on the brake the car slows." I had forgotten about the Morris Minor.

 

[Kithmo]

I stand corrected. When I wrote, "if you put your foot on the brake the car slows." I had forgotten about the Morris Minor.

So true

 

[ArfurM]

Yup, we're well beyond flaunching yer tappets, and greasing the thrutching rod... We're basically sitting in computers with a motor attached. Look at the issues VW have had with the ID3 software. As St.Elon of Musk said, "building cars is easy, developing the software is difficult.." Although those people whose car roof parted company on the motorway might disagree