SAIC in trouble? Others are growing, SAIC continues to decline.

[riddick]

Interestingly, some Chinese automakers like NIO or BYD are growing, and quite rapidly, but SAIC keeps falling. The article confirms that overall, it went down by about 39%. I'm quite shocked by how VW and GM are doing - they seem to be sinking even faster.

Can you think of any other reasons why SAIC is performing so poorly?

 

[AlexC]

Interestingly, some Chinese automakers like NIO or BYD are growing, and quite rapidly, but SAIC keeps falling. The article confirms that overall, it went down by about 39%. I'm quite shocked by how VW and GM are doing - they seem to be sinking even faster.

Can you think of any other reasons why SAIC is performing so poorly?

That is mega concerning It seems only the MG brand (which won car of year award) is doing anything decent, but may also explain why OTA updates and generally software enhancements are taking a back seat. Their IM (L6) brand does look interesting, coming to the UK.
SAIC need to ditch GM pronto, an absolute albatross around their neck, led by a corrupt ex politician that would not know difference between an electric motor and a steering wheel.
Legacy auto are basically screwed because they can't make a profit. You see VW considering closing German factories. Only Ford may make it & only with proper automation.
USA will have to relent on import tariffs as there won't be many USA brands left in a few years.

 

[DB Go Rex]

Interestingly, some Chinese automakers like NIO or BYD are growing, and quite rapidly, but SAIC keeps falling. The article confirms that overall, it went down by about 39%. I'm quite shocked by how VW and GM are doing - they seem to be sinking even faster.

Can you think of any other reasons why SAIC is performing so poorly?

SAIC is massive compared to NIO.

Fair point about VW though, they have a fight on their hands.

 

[AlexC]

VW should survive, but GM not with current so called leadership.

 

[Bam Bam]

They have a history of building cars in conjunction with Western brands, which no longer seems to be a winning formula.

One consolation is that SAIC is state owned.

Though the Chinese state do sometimes allow their state owned companies to wither under competition from the upstart firms.

 

[riddick]

I'm wondering if the delays in delivering new EV models might be contributing to the issues – for example, the Cyberster is still awaited, and in Europe, there's still no new EV SUV. The ZS EV has been around for practically 3 years, and there's nothing newer, not even a facelift. I'm not exactly sure what the situation is like in China, but more EV models are definitely needed. The MG4 is receiving praise in many places, but it's a car for a specific group of people. It's certainly not a vehicle that company owners or families would prefer. We need new EVs, and not just one. There's also a lack of small EVs, something to compete with the KIA EV3 or VW ID3. The MG3 is a hybrid; I'm looking more for a pure BEV.

 

[AlexC]

I'm wondering if the delays in delivering new EV models might be contributing to the issues – for example, the Cyberster is still awaited, and in Europe, there's still no new EV SUV. The ZS EV has been around for practically 3 years, and there's nothing newer, not even a facelift. I'm not exactly sure what the situation is like in China, but more EV models are definitely needed. The MG4 is receiving praise in many places, but it's a car for a specific group of people. It's certainly not a vehicle that company owners or families would prefer. We need new EVs, and not just one. There's also a lack of small EVs, something to compete with the KIA EV3 or VW ID3. The MG3 is a hybrid; I'm looking more for a pure BEV.

Yiu can see from the China article, SAIC is being dragged down by legacy partners that are a waste of space!
But I’m sure they have a plan. MG4 is ok for families but MG5 is bigger supporting that. MG4 may get refresh end of year / early next. Seems likely that MG3 will go BEV to address small car. And hope they improve s/w rollout.

 

[riddick]

Yiu can see from the China article, SAIC is being dragged down by legacy partners that are a waste of space!
But I’m sure they have a plan. MG4 is ok for families but MG5 is bigger supporting that. MG4 may get refresh end of year / early next. Seems likely that MG3 will go BEV to address small car. And hope they improve s/w rollout.

yes software updating is not good.

 

[Bam Bam]

I'm wondering if the delays in delivering new EV models might be contributing to the issues – for example, the Cyberster is still awaited, and in Europe, there's still no new EV SUV. The ZS EV has been around for practically 3 years, and there's nothing newer, not even a facelift. I'm not exactly sure what the situation is like in China, but more EV models are definitely needed. The MG4 is receiving praise in many places, but it's a car for a specific group of people. It's certainly not a vehicle that company owners or families would prefer. We need new EVs, and not just one. There's also a lack of small EVs, something to compete with the KIA EV3 or VW ID3. The MG3 is a hybrid; I'm looking more for a pure BEV.

Isn't the MG4 the same size as the ID3 and EV3?

MG3 is the same size as the 'ever forthcoming' ID2.

In the smaller hatchback size segment (MG3) the EV options are the corsa and e208, Zoe, and forthcoming R5. I guess the mini is also small, but doesn't seem to be a value package.

 

[BingBong]

MG have good cars, but they should lineup with BYD, xpeng, zeeker and nio in terms of technology.

 

[DB Go Rex]

MG have good cars, but they should lineup with BYD, xpeng, zeeker and nio in terms of technology.

None of the Chinese brands should be taking lessons from each other on software. They need to look elsewhere.

 

[AlexC]

You can bet they are benchmarking everything including software against Tesla. BYD, Xpeng, Zeekr, Xiomi all have good looking interface and look like they know what they are doing. MG has to catch up to that. I’m sure they know that and it’s in hand, but likely will be a few years and on revised model, not current platforms.

 

[DB Go Rex]

You can bet they are benchmarking everything including software against Tesla. BYD, Xpeng, Zeekr, Xiomi all have good looking interface and look like they know what they are doing. MG has to catch up to that. I’m sure they know that and it’s in hand, but likely will be a few years and on revised model, not current platforms.

It might look good but, the beauty is skin deep.

 

[fred12345]

It might look good but, the beauty is skin deep.

I agree range is random but works for me. I gave up on that YouTube video after 30 seconds.. "yo, what's up" "Chinese cars baaad" ...
What I paid for mine - although I don't like some bits and pieces too - I'm over the moon. Whether it stays that way or not, I don't know - same as with any cars when they go wrong ...

 

[Bam Bam]

I agree range is random but works for me. I gave up on that YouTube video after 30 seconds.. "yo, what's up" "Chinese cars baaad" ...
What I paid for mine - although I don't like some bits and pieces too - I'm over the moon. Whether it stays that way or not, I don't know - same as with any cars when they go wrong ...

He does comment early on that MG calculations are as reliable as the Western brands.

He isn't talking about MG here.

 

[BingBong]

None of the Chinese brands should be taking lessons from each other on software. They need to look elsewhere.

I disagree. They do a lot of all systems changes by OTA.

For example, here in israel the BYD atto3 is very popular and a plague of thefts of atto3 vehicles has begun. After a month the company realese security update via OTA, and also add pin to drive feature. Cars who did the update, is no longer stolen until today.

 

[DB Go Rex]

I disagree. They do a lot of all systems changes by OTA.

For example, here in israel the BYD atto3 is very popular and a plague of thefts of atto3 vehicles has begun. After a month the company realese security update via OTA, and also add pin to drive feature. Cars who did the update, is no longer stolen until today.

OTA is a great feature if what they were pushing was of decent quality...

 

[AlexC]

I agree range is random but works for me. I gave up on that YouTube video after 30 seconds.. "yo, what's up" "Chinese cars baaad" ...
What I paid for mine - although I don't like some bits and pieces too - I'm over the moon. Whether it stays that way or not, I don't know - same as with any cars when they go wrong ...

Exactly, video nonsense. You can soon match the estinated range against actual.

 

[BingBong]

OTA is a great feature if what they were pushing was of decent quality...

The point is that at the start all the Chinease brands that i mentioned had the same problems as the MG4 (LKA, AEB, ACC, uncorrected warning reading) but no one talks about that today because it's fixed for all cars semi automatically a few months ago. Now they have a very good ADAS systems.

MG also did some fixes for the ADAS systems but its not available to everyone.

Because they have a working and reliable OTA system, they can always improve their software (and they do, they realesed ota every 2 months in the last year) so its not problematic as in MG cars.

 

[AlexC]

The point is that at the start all the Chinease brands that i mentioned had the same problems as the MG4 (LKA, AEB, ACC, uncorrected warning reading) but no one talks about that today because it's fixed for all cars semi automatically a few months ago. Now they have a very good ADAS systems.

MG also did some fixes for the ADAS systems but its not available to everyone.

Because they have a working and reliable OTA system, they can always improve their software (and they do, they realesed ota every 2 months in the last year) so its not problematic as in MG cars.

Yeah and MG will catch up to the current level in a year or so.