Thinking of a new MG4 XPower or Trophy...

How many people drive more than 200 miles per day, and how does an EV become more expensive to run than petrol from that mileage onwards? Surely EVs become cheaper to run the more mileage you do, or is petrol cheaper than fast charging in the uk?
Comparing rapid charging at motorway services vs petrol from local services and the price per mile is similar. Compare motorway rapid vs motorway petrol and the EV price per mile is typically still cheaper. Charge at a Tesla site in the UK and even vs local petrol the EV is still cheaper - and cheaper still if you're charging often enough on the road to warrant taking out the Tesla subscription. :)

(Tesla sites in the UK tend to be the best value for rapid charging. I'm aware that's not always the same everywhere).
 
Compare motorway rapid vs motorway petrol and the EV price per mile is typically still cheaper
Is that strictly correct though in practice?

I also have a Seat Leon ST 2.0D 184hp and still love the interior and refinement with excellent power/economy mix with the DSG gearbox and ACC that imo is better than most others I’ve experienced. I suspect I’m not alone in my thinking that approx 500 miles from a tank of fuel means topping-up at a motorway services is only ever done in an ‘emergency’ and then only enough to give sufficient range to fill up properly after leaving the motorway. Hence fuel price differentials between town filling stations and m/way services aren’t as significant as they first appear.

Having a 150-200 mile range between top-ups in an EV certainly puts a different spin on things. It seems UK rapid/supercharging prices are artificially high (with exception of Tesla) pretty much everywhere and considerably more expensive than if you have access to cheap overnight charging rates and/or can access charging at work etc.

So for me, in the XPower, I do a 130 round mile commute 2-3 days a week which can be accommodated by topping-up overnight on the 7kW home charger at 8p/kWh. At say ave 3.0m/kWh that equates to roughly 3p/mile or £4 per return trip, after factoring charging inefficiencies.

By comparison, if I was only using rapid chargers at say 70p/kWh that would equate to c.£30 (23p/mile) for the same return trip, prior to any DC-DC inefficiencies. Even at Tesla open off-peak rate of 42p/kWh that’s still over £18 per trip

Back to the Seat; UK ave diesel price is currently around £1.42/Ltr. So at 50mpg = 12.9 pence per mile or approx £16.80 per trip

So, if your circumstances limit you to only using rapid charging you might break-even with fuel prices by having Tesla subscription but pretty much all other providers are going to make the cost prohibitively expensive.

Like most things though this is never clear cut - other factors such as lower EV servicing costs plus ‘performance for your buck’ are still likely to make it viable for many people.

Finally, as others have said, with the latest updates, I find that the MG Autopilot functions including ACC and LKA/ELK don’t cause me any problems and there are times such as when stuck in slow-moving traffic or going through 50mph speed limited m/way roadworks they can be really useful.
Oh, and did anyone mention that the sheer performance of the XPower is utterly bonkers - it will leave a lasting grin on your face every time you use it… 😜
 
By comparison, if I was only using rapid chargers at say 70p/kWh that would equate to c.£30 (23p/mile) for the same return trip, prior to any DC-DC inefficiencies. Even at Tesla open off-peak rate of 42p/kWh that’s still over £18 per trip

Back to the Seat; UK ave diesel price is currently around £1.42/Ltr. So at 50mpg = 12.9 pence per mile or approx £16.80 per trip
That is so wild to me. Thanks for crunching the numbers though, I would've never expected that.
 
That is so wild to me. Thanks for crunching the numbers though, I would've never expected that.
Same at the other side of the pond. With a good hybrid on petrol (not meaning a plugin hybrid) doing at least 20km/ltr, the cut off point is about €55 cents per kWh. This is purely based on energy costs. EV's are heavier and cost more than a hybrid. So taxes and insurance for EV's are higher to start with.
 
EV's are heavier and cost more than a hybrid. So taxes and insurance for EV's are higher to start with.
Not all countries have annual taxes on EVs and not all countries have higher insurance for them either. Here there's no annual road/circulation tax for them and insurance is no different to similar power ice cars. Also, we have lots of sun and with a home pv system, fuel is free unless you go long distances, which most people don't do most of the time. South of Europe is great for PV systems. Spain, France, Italy, Greece, Cyprus, South of Portugal etc
 
Not all countries have annual taxes on EVs and not all countries have higher insurance for them either. Here there's no annual road/circulation tax for them and insurance is no different to similar power ice cars. Also, we have lots of sun and with a home pv system, fuel is free unless you go long distances, which most people don't do most of the time. South of Europe is great for PV systems. Spain, France, Italy, Greece, Cyprus, South of Portugal etc
The initial discussion Reintje started was about energy costs: is petrol cheaper than fast charging in the uk?
I shared cost experiences similar to UK, based on kWh and petrol price.
I just added some extra cost arguments that were relevant for me.
 
My insurance went down with my EV, I suspect because this car has more safety features than my previous one, making it less likely to have an accident? That’s just pure guessing.

Road tax is pretty similar but from 2027 they are going to levy a fee on kms driven to make up for the loss in fuel excise, I believe it’s 2,5 cents per kilometer.

So do you think charging is so expensive because electricity is, or are they just jacking up pricing because they can get away with it?
 
My insurance went down with my EV, I suspect because this car has more safety features than my previous one, making it less likely to have an accident? That’s just pure guessing.

Road tax is pretty similar but from 2027 they are going to levy a fee on kms driven to make up for the loss in fuel excise, I believe it’s 2,5 cents per kilometer.

So do you think charging is so expensive because electricity is, or are they just jacking up pricing because they can get away with it?

Because they can get away with it.
 
1) only get an EV, if you have a driveway to charge at home.
I don't charge at home and am currently tracking a little under the price of a diesel through public charging only (and averaging 3.1 mi per kWh over 5500 miles as the Xpower is a thirsty girl in fun mode)

Click on the Blue writing.....

I'm with bricktop on the colour, it's not worth the kudos. If you go for xp I cannot recommend green. Get something shiny.
 
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Are you thinking of getting the model with the built in vibration mode, be sure to get the one that relaxes you, a lot on this forum seem to have bought the model that increases stress rather than reducing ........
I see the later XPower models even come with wine in the front, no idea if it ages well, but being a tad cool over there, I'd imagine it would keep well ;) :cool:

T1 Terry
 
So do you think charging is so expensive because electricity is, or are they just jacking up pricing because they can get away with it?
Because they can get away with it.
I would think that the major cost with public charging is the infrastructure: installation, depreciation and maintenance on the expensive equipment, including a lot of it in white and green boxes that people take for granted. Also council rates on valuable land space, someone has to pay for lighting even the chargers are not in use, and so on.

Then there is the electricity. Yes, they buy it in bulk, but there are also demand charges etc.

In the UK where population density is pretty high nearly everywhere, these equipment costs would be amortised reasonably quickly over thousands of charges per month, but in say regional Australia, equipment costs are a lot higher per kWh dispensed.

In some areas, cable theft and vandalism add a substantial cost.
 
In the UK where population density is pretty high nearly everywhere, these equipment costs would be amortised reasonably quickly over thousands of charges per month, but in say regional Australia, equipment costs are a lot higher per kWh dispensed.

In some areas, cable theft and vandalism add a substantial cost.
We’ve been pretty lucky with the WA EV Highway, the state government has been putting fast chargers in, no more than 200km apart, basically going along the entire coast line. Every station (as far as I know) has two CCS2 cables and a Type 2 BYO charger as a back up. Ran through the Chargefox app.
 
I would think that the major cost with public charging is the infrastructure: installation, depreciation and maintenance on the expensive equipment, including a lot of it in white and green boxes that people take for granted. Also council rates on valuable land space, someone has to pay for lighting even the chargers are not in use, and so on.

Then there is the electricity. Yes, they buy it in bulk, but there are also demand charges etc.

In the UK where population density is pretty high nearly everywhere, these equipment costs would be amortised reasonably quickly over thousands of charges per month, but in say regional Australia, equipment costs are a lot higher per kWh dispensed.

In some areas, cable theft and vandalism add a substantial cost.
Certainly part of the equation although I have nice example of creating profits here..
In my neighbourhood we have a brand new charger (double) at €0.29/kWh. The old one (also double) was 10 cents more expensive and was sold to another company recently. It came with a price increase to €0.55/kWh and with an added time-based connection fee. Nobody uses it.
 

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