Adding a Shelly WiFi controller to a Chargemaster Homecharger

[Srobb2424]

Hi can anyone point me to a link for the correct Shelly that will work for this mod please?

 

[Lovemyev]

The Shelly1 Wi-Fi relay that I was using on my dumb Rolec to charge our previous Gen1 ZS EV looks like this.

But I think this unit has been replaced / updated now and is a different shape.

There appears to be an extra terminal connection on the newer model ?.
If you are following the instructions previously outlined in this thread, then the older original Shelly unit maybe the way to go !.
Finding one “in stock” was a bit of a struggle, but here you go .

Shelly 1 – Wi-Fi Operated Smart Switch With 16A Relay |

Shelly 1 – Wi-Fi Operated Smart Switch With 16A Relay | Buy Shelly Smart Relay's From Home Products Online @ MWPHS.co.uk | Same Day Dispatch

mwphs.co.uk

 

[Srobb2424]

The Shelly1 Wi-Fi relay that I was using on my dumb Rolec to charge our previous Gen1 ZS EV looks like this.

View attachment 32296
But I think this unit has been replaced / updated now and is a different shape.

View attachment 32297
There appears to be an extra terminal connection on the newer model ?.
If you are following the instructions previously outlined in this thread, then the older original Shelly unit maybe the way to go !.
Finding one “in stock” was a bit of a struggle, but here you go .

Shelly 1 – Wi-Fi Operated Smart Switch With 16A Relay |

Shelly 1 – Wi-Fi Operated Smart Switch With 16A Relay | Buy Shelly Smart Relay's From Home Products Online @ MWPHS.co.uk | Same Day Dispatch

mwphs.co.uk

Thank you. That’s amazing you managed to find the same one from the original post in stock as when I was looking they were all out of stock. I appreciate your effort in finding it. I shall order one and follow the instruction and hopefully save me having to spend a lot more money buying a new charger.

 

[Lovemyev]

Thank you. That’s amazing you managed to find the same one from the original post in stock as when I was looking they were all out of stock. I appreciate your effort in finding it. I shall order one and follow the instruction and hopefully save me having to spend a lot more money buying a new charger.

You are very welcome !.
It did take a bit of finding .
The upgraded version maybe just fine, but you would need the help of somebody who is better qualified to give you that information.
My dumb wall box was installed way back in 2016 and Rolec units are NOT equipped with the best quality components internally TBF.
I gave up installing the Rolec branded RCBO breaker units, after three of them failed over a period of only a few years of use.
Installing a Garo branded RCBO unit was the key to success in the end.
My wall box has been totally rebuilt about 18 months ago.
There is very little now remaining internally from the original unit, in fact the back and front cases have been replaced !.
When we upgraded to the Gen2 ZS EV in 2022 there was no requirement anymore for the Shelly relay, as the car had the facility to command delayed charging cycles itself.
The Shelly still lives inside on the casing body and still operates fine from the command from my IPhone.
If I command it ON or Off - I can still hear the relay clicking inside.
I just disconnected the signal wire, as the relay is no longer required.
The Shelly was a complete and total life line when we had the Gen1 ZSEV,
Without this it would have been difficult to take full advantage of the cheaper five hours of cheaper off peak tariff ( 5p/kWh ) that we had back then !.
When I think back, it had to be the best £12 I have ever spent .
Good luck with your install !.

 

[Gomev]

...
My dumb wall box was installed way back in 2016 and Rolec units are NOT equipped with the best quality components internally TBF.
...

I think that should read 'Rolec units WERE not equipped with the best quality components internally when I got mine.'

 

[Lovemyev]

I think that should read 'Rolec units WERE not equipped with the best quality components internally when I got mine.'

Either way the components are crap .

 

[Gomev]

Either way the components are crap .

My Rolec has been performing perfectly fine. Your experience (and others) with the very early ones are not the same as those with later Rolec models.

 

[emmrecs]

My Rolec has been performing perfectly fine.

Ditto here!

 

[Lovemyev]

My Rolec has been performing perfectly fine. Your experience (and others) with the very early ones are not the same as those with later Rolec models.

Can I ask, how old is your wall box and does it still have the original Rolec branded RCB breaker unit installed?
The very early units had breakers that had blue markings, the latter so called improved breakers, had green lettering on them and intended to be more reliable.
Or, was a different manufacturer's breaker unit replaced / installed from day one ?.
The earlier blue-marked Rolec breaker unit only lasted about 10 months before burning out and was replaced under warranty, The second blue lettered RCB supplied by Rolec,failed again after a similar time scale.
Then the modified green lettered modified breaker unit was installed.
This was better, but only lasted about 14 months, before that one also burnt out !.
The EV installer then insisted on fitting a different Garo branded RCBO and this has been installed now for roughly about two years+ now.
He told me that he is spending far too much time, returning to call-backs for this same problem.
Rolec supplying the parts FOC but his time spent on call outs had to be absorbed by the installer.
So, if you do start to experience problems with your wall box tripping out and you are required to keep resetting the breaker a few times, then strongly suspect that the breaker unit is starting to fail.
The cable feeding the wall box will have suffered from excess heat and will have become affected also.
If you are still running on the original Rolec branded breaker units, then brilliant .
How frequent and how long you are charging for, will have an effect on how well these items last if course.
But they are prone to failure !.

 

[Gomev]

Can I ask, how old is your wall box and does it still have the original Rolec branded RCB breaker unit installed?
The very early units had breakers that had blue markings, the latter so called improved breakers, had green lettering on them and intended to be more reliable.
Or, was a different manufacturer's breaker unit replaced / installed from day one ?.
The earlier blue-marked Rolec breaker unit only lasted about 10 months before burning out and was replaced under warranty, The second blue lettered RCB supplied by Rolec,failed again after a similar time scale.
Then the modified green lettered modified breaker unit was installed.
This was better, but only lasted about 14 months, before that one also burnt out !.
The EV installer then insisted on fitting a different Garo branded RCBO and this has been installed now for roughly about two years+ now.
He told me that he is spending far too much time, returning to call-backs for this same problem.
Rolec supplying the parts FOC but his time spent on call outs had to be absorbed by the installer.
So, if you do start to experience problems with your wall box tripping out and you are required to keep resetting the breaker a few times, then strongly suspect that the breaker unit is starting to fail.
The cable feeding the wall box will have suffered from excess heat and will have become affected also.
If you are still running on the original Rolec branded breaker units, then brilliant .
How frequent and how long you are charging for, will have an effect on how well these items last if course.
But they are prone to failure !.

I cannot tell which components are inside as I have had no need to take my box apart since it was installed in Nov 2020.

 

[Lovemyev]

I cannot tell which components are inside as I have had no need to take my box apart since it was installed in Nov 2020.

You can get a good idea, just by lifting up the front plastic cover that protects the breaker switch in the front cover, no disassemble required.
Generally there will be the manufactures brand name printed on the front of the trip switch.
The early branded Rolec badged RCB's units are blue and also the trip reset switch is blue in colour.
The so called latter modified Rolec badged RCB's units are green, this includes the colour of the reset trip switch ( see pics below ).
I have also included a photo of the early blue breakers that burnt out.
Plus a photo of the currently installed branded Garo RCBO.

 

[5teep]

`

You can get a good idea, just by lifting up the front plastic cover that protects the breaker switch in the front cover, no disassemble required.
Generally there will be the manufactures brand name printed on the front of the trip switch.
The early branded Rolec badged RCB's units are blue and also the trip reset switch is blue in colour.
The so called latter modified Rolec badged RCB's units are green, this includes the colour of the reset trip switch ( see pics below ).
I have also included a photo of the early blue breakers that burnt out.
Plus a photo of the currently installed branded Garo RCBO.

View attachment 32374

View attachment 32375

View attachment 32376

View attachment 32377

That burned out rcd looks like the terminal had not been tightened properly?

 

[Lovemyev]

`


That burned out rcd looks like the terminal had not been tightened properly?

I fully follow your train of thought, but no sorry.
I was present when the electrician removed the front cover and his eyes focused straight on the burnt cable. He returned to his van and returned armed with a torque screw driver.
He then said :- "Do you know what this tool is used for and how it works and here is the correct torque value for that size terminal screw / cable size".
Then he check tightened the terminal and the torque screw driver clicked straight out.
Increasing the value slightly also clicked out the torque screw driver.
"I do expect to see the cable clean when I remove it, if so then that pretty much confirms that it's an internal failure inside of the breaker itself, and OBTW this NOT the first one of these I have replaced".

 

[AllyManny]

Tempted to have a go at this, but looking at the Shelly, I notice it says max 16amp. My chargemaster is 32amp - is that an issue? Were the rolec or chargemaster chargers 16 or 32amp
Appreciate any advice!

 

[Lovemyev]

Tempted to have a go at this, but looking at the Shelly, I notice it says max 16amp. My chargemaster is 32amp - is that an issue? Were the rolec or chargemaster chargers 16 or 32amp
Appreciate any advice!

This did confuse me a bit at first, but then I actual fact, after some time thinking about it, I realised that the 16 amps that the Shelly can safely switch, is MORE than enough.
Why - Because you are not switching the mains supply feed to the car, you are only interrupting the control wire, which is very low voltage and current.
I believe you can buy a timer relay that will switch the main supply, but they are very expensive when I last checked.
I tried both a Shelly device and a Sonoff Wi-Fi switching relay ( they work in a very similar way, but I found the Sonoff unit a bit of a pain getting it to pair TBH ) the relay work absolutely fine in our older dumb Rolec and it worked with out any problems over the two year plus we had our ZS EV Gen1.
We now have the Gen2 LR model, which has the delay feature already built into the car from the factory, therefore I have just left the Shelly inside the case, but just disconnected the signal wire.
So I can still control it from the app on my phone and hear it clicking ON and OFF.

[ Edit moderator: Added "and current" ]

 

[AllyManny]

Thanks. So the 16V refers to the switching current rather than the input power. It does say that on the Shelly box.
So as to not mess around with the main power input (which is a thick wire) I was thinking of taking power to the Shelly from the highlighted section below (which presumbly is powering the display on the charger). Cutting the cable and connecting the shelly via a 3-way WAGO.
Can someone who knows what they are talking about let me know if that is a sensible idea please(!)?

 

[Coulomb]

So the 16V refers to the switching current rather than the input power.

The 16A (A for amps, not V for volts) refers to the maximum safe switching current for the Shelly, yes.

So as to not mess around with the main power input (which is a thick wire) I was thinking of taking power to the Shelly from the highlighted section below (which presumably is powering the display on the charger). Cutting the cable and connecting the shelly via a 3-way WAGO.

That seems like a good way to power the Shelly. But it's not totally obvious to me that the Shelly can switch anything other than mains. Hopefully the 0 and 1 terminals are isolated, so this would be ok for switching the control pilot signal.

Though ideally I think you'd possibly want a changeover contact, with +12V on the Normally Open side, rather than merely open circuiting the control pilot. That's what I did on my EVSE, though I can't remember the reasoning.

 

[AllyManny]

Thanks. I do worry about open circuiting the pilot being bad for the battery (obviously not as crude as switching power, but still...)

 

[Coulomb]

I do worry about open circuiting the pilot being bad for the battery

Which battery and why?

 

[Lovemyev]

Thanks. I do worry about open circuiting the pilot being bad for the battery (obviously not as crude as switching power, but still...)

Here is a great video that was created four years ago by the very clever guy ( hotrex7) who was able to get his older dumb Rolec wall box to delay charge his ( then new ) MG ZS EV Gen1.
In is earlier video, he goes into long detail on how he managed to interrogate the charging system and then learn what it required in order to make it work on a delayed charge.
Remember, before this you could not carry out delayed / timed scheduled charging on the Gen1 AND especially from an App controlled easily from your smart phone !.
Big nige on this tread did a brilliant and detailed account of how this can be achieved on the Charge Master earlier wall boxes.
I have also included another video created by Matt at GoGreen Auto's, who installed the Shelly device to charge his then, ZS EV Gen 1.