Tesla Supercharger Issue MG5 LR

[tlps]

Interesting.

Just got back from a service and tesla update that did not happen....

Well it seems that all PFL MG5s need a charger swap or to be more accurate all mk1MG5s need the new charger at a cost of £500. This makes a mockery of the fact that LR PFL cars have had the software upgrade applied and work with a Tesla. The dealer have been told not to attempt the upgrade because any potential damage would be their responsibility and declined to do it. Perfectly acceptable position but they had no explanation for why some cars work fine with the update. They are in a very difficult position but they listened and we understood each other's position and we have come up with a plan to move forward.

It looks like that the SR cars have a nonupgradeable charger but the LR ones have the later upgradeable units. It could be that the mk1 MG% is actually the SR versions. AS a result the bulletin is misleading. That needs to be proved by establishing which charger is fitted to which car. The problem is it is not clear if all the LR cars have the right charger or what so the service team is going to help identify which charger is in my car. If it is an SR one then fine I understand the position. If it is a later one then it is stroppy email to MG asking what they are playing at by charging me for a new charger which I don't need. Trading standards I think would be very interested in this as it is a scam. Anyway need to get as much info to challenge the bulletin as possible.

Watch this space - waiting for my phone to charge to start plugging in the OBDII unit!

Interesting. How is the dealer going to find out which unit is in the vehicle?

Mine is due in next Wednesday for the update which the dealer has agreed to do, despite the circular from MG.

 

[shpub]

It's basically an OBD2 scan which identifies the ecus in the car and revision information. It would be really useful if your dealer could do a before and after scan of the ECUs so that we can see what the difference actually is. It also means that we have a definitive if you have this revision hardware it will work. If you don't want to publish this publically, DM me.

I am basically getting as much information on this as possible so that we have data to challenge MG with. The more I think of it, Trading Standards is probably the way forward because if MG are insisting that a different EVCC is installed when it is not required then they may well be interested in looking at why they say this.

 

[Alslad]

It's basically an OBD2 scan which identifies the ecus in the car and revision information

I've done an obd scan using carscanner and the Ezs app meant for the ZS which also seems to pull data from the MG5 (attached)

What I never thought of before now is that I think the evcc/charger is easily visible when the under bonnet cover is removed so I will take a look tomorrow and see if any identifying info can be seen on it

Edit to add landscape version of eZS screenshot with more data - thanks to MickeySw for the advice on that

 

[tlps]

It's basically an OBD2 scan which identifies the ecus in the car and revision information. It would be really useful if your dealer could do a before and after scan of the ECUs so that we can see what the difference actually is. It also means that we have a definitive if you have this revision hardware it will work. If you don't want to publish this publically, DM me.

I am basically getting as much information on this as possible so that we have data to challenge MG with. The more I think of it, Trading Standards is probably the way forward because if MG are insisting that a different EVCC is installed when it is not required then they may well be interested in looking at why they say this.

Been reading through other threads on eZS app and dongles. Unfortunately I’m a sole Apple user and don’t have an android device - I could grab a cheap second hand one if I knew how new it had to be to run the app.

 

[Coulomb]

don’t have an android device - I could grab a cheap second hand one if I knew how new it had to be to run the app.

I don't believe it has to be particularly recent, though of course it needs Bluetooth. The Google Play store says it requires Android 6.0 and up, which is quite old.

 

[Alslad]

What I never thought of before now is that I think the evcc/charger is easily visible when the under bonnet cover is removed so I will take a look tomorrow and see if any identifying info can be seen on it

Quick look under the bonnet first thing..

The carscanner app seems to have got the right serial number so I have some confidence in the rest of the output:

Charger
System supplier ECU hardware number: 10902381
System supplier ECU software number: S001R4
ECU manufacturing date 4th July 2022
Programming date 4th August 2022

Ezs doesn't pull as much data, but my earlier attachment from that app is the current firmware versions

Maybe if we can get a broad sample we might see some trends. be useful to see a facelift version and from a successfully updated pre facelift that didn't need a replacement EVCC

 

[shpub]

Quick look under the bonnet first thing..

The carscanner app seems to have got the right serial number so I have some confidence in the rest of the output:

Charger
System supplier ECU hardware number: 10902381
System supplier ECU software number: S001R4
ECU manufacturing date 4th July 2022
Programming date 4th August 2022

Ezs doesn't pull as much data, but my earlier attachment from that app is the current firmware versions

Maybe if we can get a broad sample we might see some trends. be useful to see a facelift version and from a successfully updated pre facelift that didn't need a replacement EVCC

Thanks for that. Unfortunately that is the charger and not the EVCC which is a comunication controller which I think is part of the charging port assembly but don't quote me on that. Still digging but it does look like the PFL LR cars have the same EVCC as the face lift cars. Still digging and my OBD2 scanner started playing up last night so need to sort that out but it does look like that MG are wrong about the LR vehicles needing a EVCC change. As I said not conclusive (yet) so don't beat me up if it is wrong!

Getting some eZS scans for the different versions would be very useful. e.g.

PFL SR and LR
PFL LR with software update and works with Tesla
FL without Tesla update
FL with Tesla update

There are some already on the forums so I will probably collate them first.

Been reading through other threads on eZS app and dongles. Unfortunately I’m a sole Apple user and don’t have an android device - I could grab a cheap second hand one if I knew how new it had to be to run the app.

As a mainly Apple user myself I totally understand. The easiest way is to get the dealer to use their gear to get the EVCC info before and after the upgrade. They have to do that anyway I believe or it is very easy to use.

 

[Alslad]

Thanks for that. Unfortunately that is the charger and not the EVCC

Thanks - The attached is for the EVCC info and location next to the battery. The label is difficult to see as it is facing towards the battery in a small gap - I got a snake camera in and could see the info attached.

While at your own risk, it is just 2x 8mm bolts holding the mount in place (and it looks like you would have to take them off anyway to change the battery as it sits right over the battery clip bolt) and it is much easier to see the info

Just as a recap on my car/situation if info is being collated:

72 plate pre facelift long range exclusive, registered October 2022
EVCC manufacture date via OBD scan is July 2022
Told by dealer (Luscombes) no update available for mine (Easter 2024 while in for warranty work)
Have tried a charge on an open supercharger but would not connect

 

[MickeySw]

If you hold your device in landscape mode eZS shows more info (serial #?), interestingly our FL (Trophy) shows the same EVCC FW rev as yours, I guess that probably means the HW is identical.

 

[shpub]

That is the conclusion I have come to: the LR EVCC is the same as that fitted to the FL cars with a slightly earlier MG software release. I have got data that indicates that they are the same. The first ref is the base software revision that MG receives from the supplier. The second number 111xxxx is the MG software revision that sits above it. If the supplier software is different then the is a risk of problems but it is not. This is why the pre-fl cars that have been updated work fine. The fact it is EVCC-02 implies that the SR had a EVCC-01 which had a different software base/hardware.

This does mean that there is no need to change the EVCC - "as it is the same as the original". This explains why the pre-fl LR updates have worked. The issue is this bulletin that was sent out stating the EVCC had to be changed which put the dealers is a very difficult spot because they can't take the risk of something going wrong. Some are honest about this others go into denial. I am almost tempted to do that so I could then persue MG through Trading Standards and the small claims court. You fitted a new unit knowingly under false pretenses.

To be fair this could be due to a Chinese-English translation error where someone in Asia assumed that all the pre-face lift cars had the incompatible EVCC and simply did not realise/know that the LR versions did. If that is the case, they should be able to address the issue quickly by rescinding the bulletin.

Next step is to collate this information and raise hell in MG HQ.

 

[tlps]

Would the part number for the PFL LR and FL EVCC’s be the same? If so it should be fairly easy to prove it’s the same item and therefore doesn’t need changing.

Maybe someone with a good relationship with their dealer might be able to ask the departments?

From what I tell, doing some Google image searches, there was two EVCC-02 for the 2020-2023 MG5. One has number 11313393 and the other 11182835. Evidence from this thread is that 11182835 has been successfully updated with new firmware.

EDIT: also found:
EVCC-02 10971602
EVCC-02 11170476
EVCC-01 10947807

Evidence that suggests the latter was fitted to both the 5 and ZS at times. It was also apparently from a 2022 Exclusive, which would discount that the EVCC-01 was fitted to the SR alone.

That makes at least 5 different versions of the EVCC was fitted to MG5 PFL range. Guess MG can keep costs down by fitting whatever they have to hand in the parts bin. Would perhaps go some way to explaining their position that all PFL should be updated. Easier for them to say a blanket update than test each one.

 

[shpub]

EVCC from a pre and post facelift car! Exactly the same!

 

[tlps]

EVCC from a pre and post facelift car! Exactly the same!

View attachment 26969View attachment 26970

Looking at the details of those two on eBay, one is a 2022 vehicle (PFL LS22HZU) and the other a 2020 excite. Not sure which was meant to be from FL version?

 

[shpub]

Except the manufacturing date would preclude a 2020 excite which would be a SR car. I did do some further checking and found this which came from a facelift owner. The reference numbers are the same. The LS car is definitely PFL but the other one is from a FL car. The read out below shows that the exact same unit was also in an upgraded face FL car.

 

[tlps]

Except the manufacturing date would preclude a 2020 excite which would be a SR car. I did do some further checking and found this which came from a facelift owner. The reference numbers are the same. The LS car is definitely PFL but the other one is from a FL car. The read out below shows that the exact same unit was also in an upgraded face FL car. View attachment 26974

Pretty sure his was a PFL

 

[shpub]

Just been speaking to MG customer service who told me that I had to go back to my dealer...

I then explained that I had spent over an hour going through this and had seen the MG bulletin that said change the EVCC to the same version that the FL cars use. I then said that I had that already as it was a LR version and why should I have to pay £800 to have the existing EVCC replaced with exactly the same EVCC.

He couldn't answer that but promised that he would ask the technical team to come back with an explanation. If they come back and say because it is because of compatibility then I'll hit them with all the software revision numbers etc followed by a report to trading standards.

The LR EVCC is exactly the same as fitted to the FL and has the same basic software revision that the supplier installs. MG then put their own software on top. As long as that base is compatible i.e. same revision which it is, there is no need to change the unit.

We have a fully documented FL update done on the same ECU that was fitted to a LR. They did not change the EVCC in that case so why do we need to with the LR.

As MG were quite happy until a month ago to let the dealers apply the update and those who have done have been pleased with the results, it is clearly an error on MG's part to insist on an EVCC change.

I've started the conversation.

Pretty sure his was a PFL

Yep my apologies but it doesn't change the point that pre-fl van be upgraded without this change the EVCC stuff that MG now claim.

Talking with trading standards at the moment....

 

[tlps]

Yep my apologies but it doesn't change the point that pre-fl van be upgraded without this change the EVCC stuff that MG now claim.

Talking with trading standards at the moment....

Back at #741 I said I think that Mg are treating all PFL the same, whereas there seems to be a difference between SR and LR models.

 

[shpub]

Having gone through all the ads on Ebay for the EVCC, and collating the build dates etc I am confident that:

1. The unit that is in the MG5 LR is an EVCC-02 which is the same unit as fitted to the FL cars and MG4s!
2. There are at least five different part numbers assigned to these units but the most popular is 11182835 which was made between mid 21 through to end 21.
3. These units all share a common supplier software revision: 2035374212. There is a slightly later version but that has supported the same MG software revisions.
4. The EVCC upgrade is version 1150519801 and has been applied to cars with previous versions 1114351001 and 1125788101 with success.
5. MG were allowing the PFL cars to be upgraded (albeit begrudgingly) with the software update and this fixed the Tesla problem with no apparent reported downsides since the beginning of the year.
6. MG are now claiming (April/May 2024) that all PFL cars will need a EVCC replacement to accept the Tesla update which is £500 for the unit with 3 hours labour.
7. The replacement EVCC is the same functional unit that was originally fitted to the LR PFL MG5s.
8. I believe (but have not found any confirmation yet) that the PFL SR cars used a EVCC-01 which is not compatible with the Tesla upgrade so with these cars MG are correct.
9. Trading standards have stated that MG could be discriminating PFL customers by preventing them from using a cheaper tariff offered by Tesla which is an anti-competitive practice. They also stated that the insistence on changing the EVCC when it is not needed was tantamount to fraud. However that was only first impressions as "this was the first time they had come across anything like this".
10. MG Customer service (behaved courteously and listened) state that this is a dealer problem and they should explain why such a change is needed. I replied they did not know and were as confused as the owners why an upgrade that was allowed was then changed almost overnight.
11. MG have committed to telling me why the EVCC has to be changed but I suspect that they will come back with the compatibility argument which is clearly wrong. If it introduces safety issues then why have they not recalled the cars that they have upgraded?
    
    My conclusions are that their technical department have misunderstood what the exact status is - it is complicated - made worse by the fact that the main expertise is in China which have different versions/revisions of the car. Language problems could also contribute.
    
    My suggestion to MG is that they remove this bulletin and allow all LR MG5s to be updated.
    There are no technical reasons why it cannot be done.
    
    I would be really interested if other owners have had this upgrade or been denied it because of the bulletin.

 

[shpub]

I have had a reply back from Customer service - aftersales. Vague statement that we already know!

I have it on good authority that I am right and that the EVCC does not need changing and that the bulletin should be changed to include an EVCC check to confirm its compatibility before applying the software upload. Now to get aftersales to correct themselves

Progress is being made!

---

"Thanks for getting back to me but your reply doesn't answer my question:

MG issued a bulletin which states that all PFL MG5s need an EVCC change when for the first 4 months of this year a simple software upgrade was needed.

This is not true as the PFL LR MG5s already have the correct EVCC installed and simply require a software upgrade.

The MG bulletin prevents dealers from updating the cars because MG insist on the EVCC change which is not required.

Because of this incorrect bulletin, I and many others are faced with a £800 bill to change something that does not need changing. This is fraud. Plain and simple.

The bulletin needs to be changed to state that the PFL LR cars do not need the EVCC upgrade.

Please go back to your technical team and get them to correct this.

Regards

Steve

On 04/06/2024 08:21, Customer Service wrote:

Good morning,

Thank you for getting in contact,

I have been in contact with our technical team, and they have stated that.

Its an MG product enhancement, depending on the vehicle it will either be an EVCC (electronic Vehicle Communication Controller) module replacement or the latest software or both.

If you would like enhancement to be applied to the vehicle, there would be a cost for the enhancement/repair.

If you require further assistance, please don't hesitate to get in contact.

Kind regards,

Harry
MG Customer Service
Aftersales

---

 

[EVsince2016]

This is quoted online. Maybe we could all email him if this is the correct email?

MG Motor UK Ltd Managing Director Email and Telephone​
Mr Hao Wang	Managing Director
Email	[email protected]
Advice from CEOemail.com	How to write your email to the Managing Director
Telephone	02039 175821
Switchboard	02039 175821