Electric vs Petrol vs PHEV Journey Cost

[Les burrows]

Motorway trip and city trip which is best.
Les



But if you really put you mind to it here’s what it can cost to drive 12000 miles
Les

 

[Mick b]

Well if like l charge at night at 7.5 p per kWh, it works out a lot cheaper, But the government have got to do something about fast charging prices

 

[Gomev]

Well if like l charge at night at 7.5 p per kWh, it works out a lot cheaper, But the government have got to do something about fast charging prices

I agree with the sentiment that rapid charging prices are high at the moment, they haven't always been, but why has the government got to do something about it ?
If the answer is because we want it cheaper then perhaps when they do that they will do something about the price of petrol too.
Or if the answer is to help promote the transition to EVs that could be more virtuous.

 

[Mick b]

I agree with the sentiment that rapid charging prices are high at the moment, they haven't always been, but why has the government got to do something about it ?
If the answer is because we want it cheaper then perhaps when they do that they will do something about the price of petrol too.
Or if the answer is to help promote the transition to EVs that could be more virtuous.

Yes to make EVs more appealing

 

[5teep]

I agree with the sentiment that rapid charging prices are high at the moment, they haven't always been, but why has the government got to do something about it ?
If the answer is because we want it cheaper then perhaps when they do that they will do something about the price of petrol too.
Or if the answer is to help promote the transition to EVs that could be more virtuous.

It was the government who let the utility companies raise their prices by removing the price cap, so reinstating the price cap would be a good start.
I think it's been said before that the price of electricity is based on the wholesale price of gas (???) That price is less now than it was before they "had to remove the cap" because wholesale prices had gone sky high so utility co's are raking it in.

 

[DBedford]

Which is cheaper to run?
Petrol, hybrid or full electric?

 

[Gomev]

It was the government who let the utility companies raise their prices by removing the price cap, so reinstating the price cap would be a good start.
I think it's been said before that the price of electricity is based on the wholesale price of gas (???) That price is less now than it was before they "had to remove the cap" because wholesale prices had gone sky high so utility co's are raking it in.

I'm not sure which cap you are thinking of as the only one I was aware of was to keep consumer prices down. The cap was removed as of July 1st as wholesale prices were below the cap rendering it useless.
Apologies if you are thinking of a different cap I am unaware of.
Totally agree about the link with the gas price, bonkers.

 

[Dstretty]

Well if like l charge at night at 7.5 p per kWh, it works out a lot cheaper, But the government have got to do something about fast charging prices

7.5p overnight is only actual if day rate is no higher than std rate.

Yes to make EVs more appealing

The Tory govt have abandoned any commitment to CO2 reduction. They removed the new EV purchase grant incentive (originally £5,000 now Zero).

 

[ukslim]

On a 150 mile, 3h40m journey last night, we stopped for dinner. There were Instavolt chargers in the car park (the OK Diner, Leominster). So, opportunistic charge?

Well, we would have, but we didn't need that charge, and it was 75p/kWh. So we didn't.

I think as people learn, they're going to have to lower prices to get enough custom.

 

[tsedge]

7.5p overnight is only actual if day rate is no higher than std rate.

By putting the dishwasher and washing machine on overnight we paid for the day rate increase, so it was effectively the night rate they advertised. YMMV.

 

[Lovemyev]

As we all appreciate, time of day tariffs have a much cheaper off peak rate, but the day rates are usually spiteful in an attempt to claw back the reduction given on the cheaper rate.
There is no such thing as CHEAP energy anymore, those days are are long gone !.
Sliding and therefore maximising your usage ( where possible ) into the cheaper rate hours is absolutely vital.
I quick indication if you are heading in the right direction, is when you receive your energy bill and your “off peak” consumption is higher than your day rate consumption ?.

 

[WilkoWanderer]

We are on a night tariff of 4.5p/kWh and day time 54p/kWh. Which might sound insane day but we have solar panels and battery storage. So full the batteries at 4.5p/kWh and the EV at night. So basically never use the day rate. If the government was at all serious they would make batteries cheaper or give an interest free loan or something. As shifting all use to night gives you real flexibility.

We recently did a 900 mile trip and had no choice but to use rapids and the 79p/kWh rates some charge is really hurting the economics. If it wasn't for the above I would say no point economically in getting an ev

 

[Malcolm Anderson]

I agree with the sentiment that rapid charging prices are high at the moment, they haven't always been, but why has the government got to do something about it ?
If the answer is because we want it cheaper then perhaps when they do that they will do something about the price of petrol too.
Or if the answer is to help promote the transition to EVs that could be more virtuous.

Why should they do anything about it? Its called governance, that’s what they are supposed to do. But since 2015 our government has given nearly £80billion in subsidies to fossil fuel companies! We could easily stop that and instead spend that kind of money on the charging infrastructure and perhaps a scrappage scheme for older vehicles so helping people to get the benefits of the far better fuel economy and less pollution of modern cars and so clean up our air quality. They have even let the Gas companies increase their PROFITS by 900%. Need I say more.

 

[Lovemyev]

If it wasn't for the above I would say no point economically in getting an ev

We charge almost totally from home and covered over 30,000 miles in just over 3 years.
The quick "Man Maths" tell me that covering this type of mileage in fossil car, would have been considerable more expensive ?.
Even without the benefit of the solar and battery storage you have.

 

[WilkoWanderer]

We charge almost totally from home and covered over 30,000 miles in just over 3 years.
The quick "Man Maths" tell me that covering this type of mileage in fossil car, would have been considerable more expensive ?.
Even without the benefit of the solar and battery storage you have.

Fair enough, I was thinking more if was forced to rapid chargers all the time wasn't worth it. 79p/kWh Vs 4.5p/kWh has been my experience but I guess even if had to pay 35p/kWh would still be good.

 

[tsedge]

Proper consideration of the economics requires:

• Including the capital cost of solar/battery installation and any subsequent replacement parts over time.
• The cost of buying the EV (usually a new car) and depreciation.
• Other costs like getting a home charger installed (and replacing in future).

Yes, you can "fill up" and EV really cheaply on a night rate or with solar/solar+battery, but it isn't "saving money" unless all costs are factored in.

It isn't usually cheaper than running a second hand ICE car, the cheapest motoring is usually running an old car into the ground.*

There are environmental arguments, of course, though there are arguments on both sides.

We bought an EV because we think EVs are better cars. We are not saving money due to the cost of buying a new car, even though the fuel cost is typically really low.

*This is changing as the second hand market for EVs take off, prices come down and their lower maintenance costs challenge running an old ICE car.

 

[Harry 17]

I suppose a different slant to this argument could be…..whilst the public charging companies continue to rip our eyes out with ridiculous charging per KWh. Most will use these as a last resort (baring the people who obviously have no other choice) ergo making the limited number of charging stations on our network, more readily available.

Not that I want to stick up for Bigly (Trump-speak) Corporations, but the fact that the Government told them to get on and build at their cost, then they will need to get that money back somehow.

 

[Jymbob]

All this shows is: if for some reason you need a car for 24 hours to do a 280 mile round trip and you absolutely are not wanting to stop and charge at a location that's convenient for you, maybe don't hire a car that you knew didn't have a big enough tank to do the whole journey in one go? ?

"We must itemize every fuel transaction" but "There's that £15 for driving in London?" Handwaved away

Oh, and the cost of a PV installation is typically zero over 8 years, regardless of anything else. If you have an EV you might even turn a profit before then.

 

[Tangoed Man]

Well if like l charge at night at 7.5 p per kWh, it works out a lot cheaper, But the government have got to do something about fast charging prices

True, but unless you have solar panels the daytime units claw all that back. So, on Octopus tracker I pay just 18p/unit anytime, but on the 7.5p/unit at night the daytime charge is 32p/unit.

 

[johnb80]

As we all appreciate, time of day tariffs have a much cheaper off peak rate, but the day rates are usually spiteful in an attempt to claw back the reduction given on the cheaper rate.

I just did a quick check around the energy companys in light of what you suggest:-

When you compare to my Octopus Intelligent rates I think you'll agree theyre anything but spiteful

Standing charge is 53.9p

There is no such thing as CHEAP energy anymore, those days are are long gone !.

Well not quite if you work the system to your advantage.

Sliding and therefore maximising your usage ( where possible ) into the cheaper rate hours is absolutely vital.
I quick indication if you are heading in the right direction, is when you receive your energy bill and your “off peak” consumption is higher than your day rate consumption ?.

like this

The peak use isnt quite right because of intelligent charging not being displayed correctly.