Speeding. ?☹

So while your looking at the length of the lines on the road. The gap between the lampposts. The distance and how frequent the speed signs are. Speed vans, speed cameras and the sneaky bastards on bikes. You finish up in a hedge. Probably safer to speed.

salty said:

So while your look at the length of the lines on the road. The gap between the lampposts. The distance and how frequent the speed signs are. Speed vans, speed cameras and the sneaky bastards on bikes. You finish up in a hedge. Probably safer to speed.

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Driving in the 20 mph areas in Wales at the moment ,you are also very likely to get shunted

tsedge said:

Thought I'd contribute my experience here.

Was recently given the "opportunity" to do a Speed Awareness course (48mph in a 40, although was an empty dual carriageway). Apparently anything up to 53 could result in a course being offered.

To be honest I am embarrassed as I make it a point of sticking to the limits and this was an occasion where I had a sick cat in the car and was late for the vets. But that is no excuse.

Actually found the course really good and worth the £100. Nine of us, good teacher and most of us (including myself) got a least one thing wrong about speed limits.

Biggest learning points:

1. Dual carriageway is nothing to do with the number of lanes, it is about whether there's a physical separation between carriageways (grass, barrier, kerb, whatever). Continuous tarmac is one large single carriageway even if 4, 6, 8 lanes (so 60mph max).

2. "Crawler" additional lanes don't make it a dual carriageway on one side, still single carriageway speeds (60mph for cars/motorbikes).

3. Many people unaware that vans and trailers have lower speed limits.

4. 30mph default anywhere there are no signs but there are streetlights (20mph in Wales).

These points were new to some/all of our group.

Also found the section on emotional reactions and how to deal with them quite useful.

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Just looked this up and on point 1 you are correct.......and wrong? Technically the dual carriageway could be 1 lane in each direction separated by a physical barrier and the national speed limit of 70mph would apply unless signage says different. ( understanding the National speed limit ,website ) Point 1 suggests motorways are 60 mph.

OriginalBigAl said:

Just looked this up and on point 1 you are correct.......and wrong? Technically the dual carriageway could be 1 lane in each direction separated by a physical barrier and the national speed limit of 70mph would apply unless signage says different. ( understanding the National speed limit ,website ) Point 1 suggests motorways are 60 mph.

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Motorways and dual carriageways are 70mph. It is a dual carriageway when there's a separator between each side (hence two separate strips of tarmac, not one wide strip with opposing traffic only separated by paint markings on the road).

You can indeed have a single lane dual carriageway, two separate carriageways with one lane in each direction, although it is relatively rare. The speed limit if not otherwise marked is then indeed 70mph.

Twin lane single carriageways: ie two lanes in each direction with only paint lines between the opposing traffic directions, in other words a single wide carriageway / strip of tarmac, are 60mph (50mph for vans and trailers).

maskull said:

Don't get me started on Quorn. Those damn vegans eating them to extinction

The incident I refer to was probably 30 or 40 years ago.
I be very old

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I had a proper maroon booklet before these plastic driving licence cards came on the scene. I’m sure I’ve still got it somewhere

DixieTGS said:

The distance part of the rule has gone. It's now whenever street lights are present.

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You maybe should inform the government of this.

Section 84 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984.

Any speed limits below 30mph, other than 20mph limits or 20mph zones, require individual consent from the Secretary of State for Transport.

Unless an order has been made and the road is signed to the contrary, a 30mph speed limit applies where there is a system of street lighting furnished by means of lamps placed not more than 200 yards apart.

Traffic authorities have a duty to erect and maintain prescribed speed limit signs on their roads in accordance with The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016 as amended.

If traffic authorities wish to deviate from what is prescribed in signing regulations, they must first gain the authorisation of the Secretary of State for Transport.

johnb80 said:

You maybe should inform the government of this.

Section 84 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984.

Any speed limits below 30mph, other than 20mph limits or 20mph zones, require individual consent from the Secretary of State for Transport.

Unless an order has been made and the road is signed to the contrary, a 30mph speed limit applies where there is a system of street lighting furnished by means of lamps placed not more than 200 yards apart.

Traffic authorities have a duty to erect and maintain prescribed speed limit signs on their roads in accordance with The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016 as amended.

If traffic authorities wish to deviate from what is prescribed in signing regulations, they must first gain the authorisation of the Secretary of State for Transport.

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Looks like the speed awareness course guy was wrong. I wonder where he got his information from .

I've always thought that the whole speed limit rule system needs to be made clearer. It feels at times like a game of "Go Johnny Go Go Go Go" Where a limit can be X unless Y but can be Y unless Z or V etc etc

The limit will be clearly displayed on your drivers dash screen.
Right got my hardhat on...... fire away!

I drive morgans . For some reason the speedo is on my wife's side. I don't need fancy electronics I have Jan Nav. And very good she is too

OriginalBigAl said:

The limit will be clearly displayed on your drivers dash screen.
Right got my hardhat on...... fire away!

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Mmm, wondered what that was?

OriginalBigAl said:

The limit will be clearly displayed on your drivers dash screen.
Right got my hardhat on...... fire away!

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To be honest I've been finding my sign recognition to be reasonably accurate on my MG4 Trophy (r63 update version )

Back in the good old days (80's) I was running in (remember that) my brand new Astra GTE with wonderful wizzy new LCD dash with digital speed indicator. Trundling along at 42 on the M3 I thought this is a nice ride, seems to be going along quite well, wonder why everyone else is dawdling. I was enlightened by the Superintendent (natch) in the unmarked Granny that spied me from the top of an elevated on-ramp (invisible to me) that I was doing around 100 (his constabule matey spent the time of my lecture ogling the car). Think I was close to disqual as that was when they started getting heavy but pleading guilty with much mitigation probably helped. The lesson I took from it was to use the performance to get to the limit quickly and use the handling to keep up a good pace. Compared to the 70's when I started driving it's horrendous as the cars are so much faster (Vauxhall Chevettes fell off the road at 40mph) and the detection technology is all hidden or mobile and the penalties are vicious. I guess we just need to be extra vigilant.

It's not as hidden as it once was.

Back in the 1990s I regularly drove into London for choir practice, taking the A3 and then turning left towards Hammersmith bridge. On the section of the A3 just before the turnoff I watched as a speed camera was erected on the opposite carriageway just a few yards beyond (from the point of view of drivers on that carriageway) a large direction sign. It was impossible to see it when driving towards it. It was a complete trap.

Once it was operational, every single time I drove that road in the early evening, it was flashing away at almost every car that passed. I dread to imagine how many they caught. (Of course I was damn careful when returning that was later in the evening.)

I realised later when driving along the length of the A3 just how bad a trap it was. Drivers on that road were constrained by traffic until the lights where I usually turned off the road. Once past these lights the road widened into three lanes, I think, and the temptation to pick up speed was irresistible, particularly as it was downhill. But the speed limit didn't change till the bottom of the hill.

There was quite a lot of pushback about hidden cameras in general, and eventually it was changed. The previously grey cameras were painted with yellow stripes, and that particular one was moved out of the shadow of the direction sign so that drivers could see it before they came to it. I guess the exchequer must have missed the income!

JohnV6 said:

Where there is a clear barrier then the limit is 70 on a dual carriage. If there is no barrier it is 60.

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There nothing in law about 60mph without a barrier?

Having a quick recount of previous cars I've owned, around 70% are in the category were the speed limit was an ambition as opposed to a target.

OriginalBigAl said:

Having a quick recount of previous cars I've owned, around 70% are in the category were the speed limit was an ambition as opposed to a target.

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That reminds me of the lad I used to work with bragging to a lot of disbelieving work mates that his Morris Marina TC could do 108 mph....


....and he had a certificate to prove it from the police

salty said:

Fair enough, I doff my cap, to you Sir. ??

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It's OK sticking to the limit when you know it. But I was in a situation driving for work in Staffs. It was a 60 road coming into a 40. But the problem was the sign on the right hand side had been turned round and the one on the left was covered with foliage.

But when I went back to get pictures to fight it, the sign was turned back and the bushes trimmed.

securespark said:

It's OK sticking to the limit when you know it. But I was in a situation driving for work in Staffs. It was a 60 road coming into a 40. But the problem was the sign on the right hand side had been turned round and the one on the left was covered with foliage.

But when I went back to get pictures to fight it, the sign was turned back and the bushes trimmed.

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A dashcam always helps.